Emory professor Erica Armstrong Dunbar has written or co-authored eight books that share the often-overlooked historical experiences of Black American women from Harriet Tubman to Ida B. Wells.
The acclaimed scholar’s storytelling skills even earned her a finalist ranking for the 2017 National Book Award for Nonfiction for “Never Caught,” her narrative account of Ona Judge, an enslaved woman who liberated herself from George and Martha Washington.
Emory professor Erica Armstrong Dunbar, an acclaimed author, teacher, and co-executive producer for “The Gilded Age.”
Photo by Whitney Thomas
The character functions as a composite of real Black women from the era, including journalists Ida B. Wells and Gertrude Bustill Mossell and novelist Julia C. Collins. “The Gilded Age” focuses on the late-19th-century struggle between old-money elite and new-money families in Manhattan. During an interview for the show’s new season, Benton praised Dunbar’s impact in enriching Peggy and other Black characters.
“It makes me emotional to think about how far we’ve come since 2019 with the show,” Benton told The Times. “Originally, we were going to watch Peggy walk a very narrow path and see her parents sometimes. And Dr. Erica Dunbar and I were able to be like: 'We have an opportunity to show something that’s never been onscreen. We have to widen this lens.' And now we have a robust Black cast on this show. We have Black writers; we have so much richness.”
Dunbar earned an Emmy nod last year for her work as the show’s historical consultant and co-executive producer. This fall, just weeks after the season finale, she began teaching undergraduate students about her research into the lives of African Americans from enslavement up to Reconstruction.
We asked Dunbar, professor of African American studies, to share her experiences shining a light on racial and gender injustice on the show and how she balances her work on “The Gilded Age” with her scholarly research, collaborations and courses at Emory. This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.
How did you originally get connected with ‘The Gilded Age’? Has working in popular media always been an interest?
I had worked in television before, but on the documentary side — I had never even thought of working in scripted television.
I started working with the production in 2019, when it was in development. A producer reached out and said they were working on a period show for HBO with a storyline centered on a Black woman. They knew I was an expert in African American women’s history and asked if I was interested in reading through a couple of early scripts for historical accuracy and cultural sensitivity.
I don’t know how they found me, but I said sure, not knowing what the show was or who created it. I just signed the NDA [non-disclosure agreement], read the scripts and marked them up with comments and suggestions — like what I would do for students — and sent it back. I thought that was that.
How did your involvement first expand?
That producer called me a few weeks later and said the show’s creator liked my notes and wanted to meet with me. That’s when they told me the creator was Julian Fellowes and asked if I was familiar with his work. Of course I was — I watched “Downton Abbey” religiously.
At the end of that meeting, he asked if I would consider coming on as a historical consultant, reading every script.
For me, it was a new way of doing historical work. I also understood that there would be a different set of parameters for a fictional show. For a few months, I acclimated to it being a drama, not a documentary, by writing notes and comments on scripts and sometimes calling to talk to Julian and co-writer Sonja Warfield.
How did you go from consulting to producing?
It quickly became clear my notes were more about story development, especially around the Peggy Scott storyline. That’s when they promoted me to consulting producer, in addition to my work with historical consulting.
That morphed into an even larger role when, instead of going into production in March 2020, the pandemic forced us to pause. I was already thinking about story rather than strictly facts. Then came a moment where everyone had time to think more broadly about a story that allows us entrance into the world of the Black elite in 1880s New York City.
I saw an opportunity for us to do something we had never really seen in television, to explore a world of Black privilege and expand the traditional storyline of 19th-century Black America. We think we know that story. It’s about sharecropping or very Southern and oppressed — at least, that’s what we have seen on television. We had never seen a depiction of Black life in 1880s New York, and my argument was that you can’t understand New York at the time if you can’t understand the role of the Black elite.
Denée (Benton) was also vocal about the opportunity to tell a different kind of story with Peggy Scott. Peggy was originally slotted to be a domestic, which was in large part the work many Black women in 1880s New York engaged in to earn money. But we knew there were other forms of employment opening up, and we could tell the story of Black advancement and triumph as well as the disrespect and indignities that Black New Yorkers faced every day, no matter their class or education.
Having more time to think about it showed us we had the opportunity to think about Peggy as a fictional character in a way that included non-fictional people and moments.
The show’s actors lauded your involvement in that storyline in The New York Times story this summer. How did you ensure your ideas would balance historical accuracy with the creative license for fictional storytelling?
The story already has historical white figures, such as Mrs. (Caroline) Astor and J.P. Morgan. It was Julian who had the idea to make Peggy a secretary. That made sense for employment at the time and allowed her to have career aspirations on the side.
I was thinking of her as a journalist, like Ida B. Wells. Then we tied her story to a real person, T. Thomas Fortune, who was the most well-known Black journalist of the decade and ran what is arguably the most influential newspaper in New York.
Now you have a storyline that allows us to explore the foundations of historically Black colleges and universities (HBCUs). Peggy was educated at the Institute for Colored Youth in Philadelphia, the oldest of all the HBCUs, now known as Cheyney University. We have Peggy and Fortune go to Alabama for the founding of Tuskegee University. We tied the focus and commitment of Black education post-emancipation to Peggy’s character and life.
Sunday nights at 9 p.m. is the biggest classroom I have ever had. I adore teaching 25 students in my classrooms on Mondays and Wednesdays. I also recognize the importance of being able to share some of that knowledge with five million people on a Sunday night, in a textured and story-driven way.
With ‘The Gilded Age’ renewed for a fourth season, do you have stories you would like to see included in future episodes?
I was not originally sure where a scholar or historian would fit in the world of television, but it has become very clear to me that there should be multiple historians included if we want to tell accurate stories.
I continue to read across seasons for historical accuracy and share ideas on several storylines, but “The Gilded Age” also has additional researchers. I still work on my teaching job at Emory and on book projects. Having multiple eyes on multiple storylines is better for the show.
I work on research packets for Julian and Sonia before they start writing scripts. Julian is very, very committed to having every detail be as authentic as possible.
Ultimately, people are driven by authentic human stories. We think about the importance of that authenticity, even though we know it’s fictional. I have spent 25 years as a scholar focused on my craft, but this has taught me there is space for my research in all creative spaces, including television and film. Ultimately, it’s about the story, and I am a storyteller.
Has that realization and your involvement with the show influenced how you teach at Emory?
I am very fortunate to have spent six years getting to weigh in on a show that works so hard to ensure that the audience is engaged with the story.
I took that lesson with me when I completely changed how I deliver my lectures. I never had text-only slides, but now I include moving images, historical photos and even audio recordings of formerly enslaved people.
This fall, my first lecture opened with my own introduction to slavery, playing the students scenes from “Roots” and explaining what that meant to America and to television in the 1970s.
I have tethered film, television and audio to every lecture, because I want them to leave each time with a memorable experience, where they want to talk about what they’re seeing and learning.
If I am going to compete with their phones and social media for attention, I think it has to be through storytelling that is provocative and inspires them to ask more questions. That will always be central to what I do. It reminds us of the long ago and far away, but also of real people with human stories.